Dialogue with the grand children (Saliem children)
El Obeid 9/5/74
The month that I spent in El Obeid was a period of relaxation and nice chatting with the boys and they were very happy with their grandfather and they recorded a tape where I answered their questions and there were many and interesting about live, religion and philosophy. The important thing is that this tape has become a historical event.
I notice that you study either in the kitchen or on the kitchen table. What is the story? Do you get inspiration from the pots of food and eating the corns of Al Sham (corn in the cob).
Dialogue with my Grandchildren
Amier: I asked my father who is your highest role model in your life?’ and he said to me, ‘my father’. What do you think of this?
Bolis: I appreciate your father’s feelings and thank him but I would like the answer to be: the highest example in all our actions is only one person, he is Our Lord Jesus Christ.
Amir: I see that all your sons have grey hair. When you were their age was your hair grey?
Bolis: Grey hair or you mean silver hair. From the age of forty my hair started to go silver and I now see that Saliem’s is starting to turn silver. By the way, my hair used to be somewhat golden. We are in a tough time and it changes gold into silver and we thank God for everything.
Amir: I would like you to describe each of your children: my father (Saliem), Ramsis, Amazis, Zoser, Joseph, Rose
Bolis: This is a long story and I am afraid that if I start giving each one some characteristics, this will cause a kind of competition. I think that before I give a reply to this question, I would like to tell you that a man was asked: which of your children is the most loved by you? His reply was: The one who is away, until he comes back; the sick until he gets well; the small until he grows. In other words all the children are loved and they are all the same in the eyes of their parents, even if they each have different talents. Generally, we can say that Saliem and Ramsis have very kind hearts and they are happy going.
Amazis is a serious man and puts all his energy into his studies and he appears to be rough on the surface but in reality, this is only a cover because he is very sensitive and has a very kind heart.
As for Mr Zoser, he is a pure scientist but a diplomat of the first class and has a kind heart; this is a common factor in all of them.
Joseph is very similar to Zoser in his characteristics and behaviour and we wish him a great future in his studies in the faculty of medicine.
As for Rosemary, she needs a lot of words because, being the only daughter in the family, she has a special place with her father and her brothers and the rest of the family. It is enough to say that she is dearly loved and she is excellent. This is saying enough.
Amir: All of your children are named Pharaonic names, except Rosemary, why did you not give her an Egyptian name and why did you choose these Pharaonic names?
Bolis: These Pharaonic names have a long story that is associated with the ancient history of Egypt and the ancient language, whether that be the Coptic or Hieroglyphic language. I have for a long time been interested in these studies and I gave all my sons Pharaonic names. As for Rosemary, her name was Isis but it happened that in the same class at school there was a girl with the same name but she was very stupid and so Rosemary hated the name and changed it.
Amir: What is your advice to Imad. He is obstinate, even when he is in the wrong?
Bolis: I cannot agree with you on this because what I see is that he likes to raise issues so as to create dialogue and discussion to reach a logical and reasonable solution and this is a sign of independence in thinking and an audacity in expression and I do not see any harm in this if it is well used. I do not agree with you on this.
Amir: What is the best advice we can take from you on this thorny path of life?
Bolis: Advice is cheap and easy especially at my age. When people reach my age, they like to give advice to others. The result is that young people do not like or want old people because the new generation wants to write their own trials and experiences by themselves. But, if I have to give an advice, it would be: ‘Put the fear of God and service of others before everything else and I would not add to this.
Amir: I hope that next year, we meet again and chat together. Thank you.
Imad: What is the most beautiful verse of poetry that you read, in English or Arabic?
Bolis: You cheeky boy, you have become serious from the very first question, this is a big question and I need to give a brief answer. There have been a lot of beautiful lines of poetry among my readings, but I remember a line for the Poet Shawgi where he says:
The best simile that I read is a description of life and death by the Poet Tagore. He says about death that it is similar to the mother when she pulls her breast from her child’s mouth to give him the other. I suggest that you read a lot of English poetry and it would be good if you find a copy of the poetry of Tagore because it contains a great deal of wonderful mystic messages which you cannot find in a lot of the Eastern or Western poetry.
Imad: What is the most beautiful book you read, and the most boring one?
Bolis: I do a lot of reading and it is difficult for me to identify one book and describe it as the most beautiful thing I ever read. But, I can say that the most beautiful book and one that I really admired and found to be mentally stimulating and enjoyable is the Dialogues of Socrates. I suggest that you read it in English. As for the most boring book, I cannot mention any and if I were to store in my brain the names of boring books, this would be a bad story, because I do not keep such boring things in my store room.
Imad: What careers or professions do you wish each of us to have?
Bolis: I cannot say that Amir will be such and such and that Najy will be so and so and that Imad will be such and such. But, I wish for everyone to be successful, not the cheap kind of success which most people run after, like a job or money or an eminent position in society. No, I want each one of you to succeed in the work that you do in a real way.. true success. This means being able to achieve the goal that you aspired for or set to achieve from the day you set foot in the University or College and to make your aim in life the service of others before yourself. Big ambitions, to be like great personalities that we hear about in the community, in history, in the papers, these things do not come to my mind. I simply like virtue and search for it and love those who love virtue and search for it. I read a lot of Greek literature and philosophy, especially Socrates and Aristotle. I think Aristotle is a very high example of the search for good or beauty or virtue or wisdom and all these are different words for the same thing which he called ‘The Good’.
Imad: Suppose you were hungry and you heard of a book that cures hunger without eating and you had some money, would you buy the book or buy something to eat?
Bolis: Imad, I think this is a riddle. It is a simple matter. If we suppose that we bought the book that cures one of hunger without eating, this will be an experiment that will either succeed or fail. Success is not guaranteed. But, if I bought a loaf of bread and ate it, then it is a hundred percent guaranteed that I will cure my hunger. Therefore, buying a loaf of bread is better than buying a book which might or might not cure my hunger.
Imad: Are you ashamed of being described as Coptic?
Bolis: First, I disagree totally with the word ‘Coptic’ because to me it represents unhappy things from our ancient and more recent history. The word in itself does not mean anything. In our time, it means ‘Christians who are from an Egyptian origin’. The original word, that should be used in place of the word ‘Coptic’, is the word ‘Kimi’ and the word ‘Kimi’ means Egypt and we are Kimians ‘Kimiin’ which means we are Egyptians. In this way we can connect our past to our present and bring to life memories that we like, that we cherish on our journey in history which extends back seven thousand years. The word ‘Kimi’ includes all the Egyptians who live in Egypt and the word ‘Egypt’ is also an imported word…. I would like to see the word ‘Kimi’ used instead of the word ‘Egyptian’ or ‘Coptic’.
Imad: Who would you like to follow? Akhenaton or Buddha?
Bolis: I admire Akhenaton and admire Buddha but I do not like to follow either of them. Akhenaton ventured very bravely and tried to unify the Egyptian gods but he symbolised them in the sun and he did not call to the worship of one god, as some European historians claim, but he called for the worship of the sun and I do not agree with this. But my disagreement does not mean that I do not admire him as an Egyptian who tried to present a new idea to humanity.
As for Buddha, I consider him one of the greatest personalities that appeared in history and that had a great influence. He is a good teacher who called people to love, brotherhood, and kindness to man and animal and he called for very high values and morals. But, like many other wise men and prophets he cannot give the human soul peace and salvation because he shares with us our problems, our shortcomings and our sins. But the person who is the greatest example and the one that I follow and love and I believe in is Jesus Christ, the son of God.
Imad: If the Jin of Solomon comes to you, what would you ask of him?
Bolis: This is a very improbable question because it is very imaginary and unrealistic.
The word ‘Jin’ means ‘obscure’ and I do not like to deal with obscure matters and I do not know how to deal with them and I do not know how Solomon did so. We as Christians need to see ourselves as children of Light or followers of the Kingdom of Light which gets its light from the light of Jesus Christ. Obscure things are dark but the things that belong to the kingdom of light, they are all lighted and Our Lord Jesus is Light because He gives light to darkness and those who follow Him do not know darkness and do not connect with the jin whether it be from Solomon, peace be upon him, or not.
Roumani: What do you think of ‘Tooto Koora’ ?
Bolis: Ya Roumani ya Kourdoufani, you do not have any other questions but ‘Tooto Koora’?* I do not know Tooto Koora, and I do not play Tooto Koora and I do not want Tooto Koora. I tell you a little story: one day, my son Ramsis, asked me to fill-in a column of Tooto Koora. I said to him: ‘Why ?’ He said, ‘so you can win a big sum of money’. I said to him, ‘my son, every morning I pray to our Lord and I say “give us our daily bread”, every day I ask Him.. Do you want me to leave Him and follow Tooto Koora and ask it for a thousand pounds? I can never do this and I totally disagree with it and may God help you because you run after these things.
Roumani: Jido, which of your children do you love the most ?
Bolis: You are a clever and cheeky boy, ya dadi ya bitaa al zabadi…. This is a good question but I have already given the answer to it and I said that the one that is loved the most is the youngest until he grows and as you are the youngest, then you are the one that I love the most. Are you happy now ?
* ‘Tooto Koora’ is a guessing game like ‘footy tab’ or ‘lotto’
***********************